The End (Die's in a Blaze of Glory)

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Postby Arioch » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:14 am

Generic scenario: You (which ever guild you are in) get ready to attack someone with a higher net worth and 2x the members than you. It's all cool though because you have an ally that will balance that out. Your war chat is first and you commit. Do you want to play with someone that abandons you to those odds after you already hit or someone that keeps their word and fights? That is where SoL is coming from Lance. Sorry if it makes things worse at your end. Not trying to rain on anybody's parade.
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Postby hhh » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:18 am

damn.. i better read all the entries before i post.

It's just a game guys. Does it ruin your real life to lose acres in a game? I tell you when I get dropped or killed I shake my head and grin saying damn they used alot of turns on me and go about a counter. This is supposed to be a fun distraction from RL right?


it stops being fun when people decide to go somewhere IRL to be distracted from the game. you guys can spin your way out of every mess you make. doesn't really matter what you have to say.

war on.
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Postby Hollisandra » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:34 am

Ya know what... I'm done posting in here after this post...

I've had allies drop out right before the war started, I've had allies drop out of the war in the middle of it, hell I've even had allies not do a damn thing during a war... so spin it however you like guys.

What Ricardo did was wrong by saying they were suiciding in this war to then have SoL hit. *shakes head*

*smiles wanly and waves*
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Postby Fo » Wed Apr 11, 2007 10:49 am

I will expand on what I typed earlier about free land. I do not doubt that MuM could inflict damage to some TDoD realms and grow in the initial battle. But if the war was to go on more than 3 or 4 days TDoD would end up being the net land holder. In the short one day war we just had with TDoD I saw that they were active enough to stop any kind of hit made by a guild that was lower ranked and had less members.

When I first read this thread I believed that MuM was hitting alone and getting ready to take a break for an age. Part of me was like, hey good to have some one go out in a blaze of glory, but another part of me was like, damn it, the heathens will gain land. Because I still want to see an Angelique guild win this age. Yes the age could end any time and our faith is currently in third place for having the top ranked guild, but that is how I roll. I'm on it till the buzzer sounds.

What I think happened here was that Ricardo meant what he said and was frustrated by the low turn out and he isn't lying about not being happy with this age. That there had been talk between SoL and MuM about the war, but communications from people living on the other side of a large ocean were not cordinated because of the time diference. This is speculation on my part, so take the actors words over mine, of course.

Torkano says it well about seeing from both ways.
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Postby MoP » Wed Apr 11, 2007 12:02 pm

Fo is kinda right, I think. Ric was truly fed up with things in the game and with the low turnout.

Just read his first post again. It's the full truth how he felt. He didn't know SOL entered the war till I told him this afternoon.
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Postby owly » Wed Apr 11, 2007 1:22 pm

It Sad to see MuM going out in any kind of way especially when i respect the Guild so much...

*tips hat*
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Postby DKII » Wed Apr 11, 2007 2:16 pm

"So this war is basically Ricardo Cassidy, Lucie Sundance and Doc Banker against TDoD- "

Tork - Ric himself said the war is just MuM against TDoD, even though he was already planning on having SOL jump in to claim all the land later. As far as I can see SOL is interfering with the declared war. (though it really is Ric's fault, not SOL's, I mean Ric didn't even tell his guild what was going on)

I don't know why this is even ambiguous, it's clear TDoD was treated like shit yet again. I guess next time another guild hits MuM while TDoD is hitting them, TDoD should just keep going and drive MuM into the ground 'cause otherwise MuM will turn right around and pull whatever dirty tricks it can to take TDoD down anyway.
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Postby DKII » Wed Apr 11, 2007 2:24 pm

PS: I just declared war on TNE. I may or may not have other allies coming to hit you later. Oh no!
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Postby MoP » Wed Apr 11, 2007 2:46 pm

You sneaky sod!

Can I be your ally?

EDIT: Damn font is too big!
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Postby Torkano » Wed Apr 11, 2007 3:02 pm

DK, I said already that Ric shouldn't have been specific when he was talking about who was warring. SOL said they were invited. If Ric didn't tell them not to hit them I can only assume as well as SOL that Ric wanted them to hit. So there should be no blame on SOL for anything. If it was a planned combine attack, there is no interfering. Like I said with the one guild referrence, just because they all don't hit at the same chat time doesn't mean the rest of the guild is interfering in an already started war. I find it amusing that you call this interferrence. Holding out allies has been a common thing of the past, and I find it amusing that you call this interfering when a guild you are affiliated with has done it in the past along with many others including TNE. Its not uncommon. If the player base was much larger, I would have said this is crappy for the fact that they should've said allies will enter later but they won't say who it is. Unfortunately, if MuM mentioned allies it would be easy to assume its SOL since the numbers are pretty well matched up.
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Postby General Andy Icarn » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:02 pm

Gili or someone else "in charge" could you go to MuM forum and clarify what the current plan is. There's no posted numbers if we're still warring and no plans to do anything else if we aren't still warring. So I'm holding actions atm.

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Postby Ash » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:05 pm

Torkano wrote:DK, I said already that Ric shouldn't have been specific when he was talking about who was warring. SOL said they were invited. If Ric didn't tell them not to hit them I can only assume as well as SOL that Ric wanted them to hit. So there should be no blame on SOL for anything. If it was a planned combine attack, there is no interfering. Like I said with the one guild referrence, just because they all don't hit at the same chat time doesn't mean the rest of the guild is interfering in an already started war. I find it amusing that you call this interferrence. Holding out allies has been a common thing of the past, and I find it amusing that you call this interfering when a guild you are affiliated with has done it in the past along with many others including TNE. Its not uncommon. If the player base was much larger, I would have said this is crappy for the fact that they should've said allies will enter later but they won't say who it is. Unfortunately, if MuM mentioned allies it would be easy to assume its SOL since the numbers are pretty well matched up.


Well, a simple "MuM is now at war with TDoD" would've done. Leaves both ends open.
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Postby Fo » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:07 pm

Hmm.. maybe you haven't heard anything because Ricardo is out drinking. Everyone seems to look past that part of his post about him taking up heavier drinking.
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Postby Ricardo » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:08 pm

So much to write about, I seem to have been accused of lots of things - oh well I'll live with it, just like everything else I have been accused of from coping off with my mates missus to taking the last Mr Kiplings Cherry Bakewell.

Fo had basically gotten it spot on in the turn of events.

My first post was how it was, nothing more nothing less - however I will roll back the clock a little further to clarify certain areas of greyness.

I posted war for Tuesday at 4pm EST on the banner on Sunday - no set target but it would have been TDoD or DoW. Cant remember how many members for certain i had then may have been 10 or 12 - I had asked those whom could not be active to respect the rest of the guild members whom in war would ahv to carry them - I know that Zhord and Strouse left but cannot be certain of when.

I logged on last night around 3.30pm EST with the intention of MuM hitting one of the said targets - I looked at the ransk and decided on TDoD - tough ask but hey what the hell - so for those that screamed for ranks - here they are from when I made my decision:-

THE DAWN OF DISCORD (TDoD) 15 475,591
DOGS OF WAR (DoW) 11 362,463
DISCIPLES OF CHAOS (DoC) 7 351,803
MERRY UNION OF MERCENARIES (MuM) 9 342,653

I then read my news about Trems dom getting killed, so he gets killed again outside of war - so I am obviously very happy with this snippet.

I then read the PM from Exile and you have seen my response - so MuM was gonna hit TDoD - if SOL came along for the ride then fine we were hitting anyway. I had no prearranged war chat time with them had not even had an ok from Exile - so to say I knew SOL was coming along afterwards is a little of the mark for sure.

So there I am sat in the war chat room - notice Lucie is in there to, I go off and scout TDoD to see what they have whilst I await others to show - I had a scribe from Die to say he would be an hour late - so knew he wouldnt show, I also know Andys generally around but not in war chats - so i am not that fussed about him not being there as it was usual.

So I wait, and I wait, my blood begins to boil a little as this is the second time on the trot I have done it within a few weeks where it has been 2/3 people in a war caht. The alst time was the Firday prior to TRCs hit on us - which resulted in me calling off the war and then we get hit by TRC pretty much as I put my kingdom on vacation when i went to India for a weeks business.

So what do I do now, do I cancel another war chat - only to get hit as Kenchan had seen my scout on him and I had looted another TDoD for my war fund?

As I said the mayonnaise (just for u Torky) had set in MuM from the war merger - things were at an all time low within the guild - I had been thinking of disbanding the guild after this age anyway. As my usual trusted guild buddies of Gili, Zhord, Seer, Bootsy, Trem etc had either gone or were jsut not interested. Others had been connection probs like Coolz, Gordon, Strouse; othe guildies like Lucie, Die Banker, Andy online time fluctuated and they are in a diff time zone to me - so pretty much war chats were getting lonely for me - with only Wags being anywhere near me in timezone.

So all in all I was pissed off, fed up and had really just enough of being unable to get my shit together let alone anyone elses in the guild.

So as I say what do I do, I spoke to Lucie as the only other person in the war room and said I was gonna hit TDoD - that nice fat juicy 22k acred dom whom and had given me cash and was forted craply -and that I advised her to move to another guild as the hits would come raining down from TDoD. She stood by me and wanted in - hence the Butch and Sundance analogy sprung to my mind.
Then Die came online just as I was gonna hit and I gave him the same option - he also said he was gonna go down fighting with me and Lucie.

After the three of us had hit 3 TDoD dom between us - I noticed Coolz had got online and had hit somone as he had noticed the war dec on the banner - so he joined in - all of whom I had posted had hit on Page 1 of this love in.

At roughly 6pm EST I went to bed - I had no contact from any other member of MuM or any member of SOL before this time after my hit.

As I also stated if other members of MuM hit it was up to them, we were a 9 member guild - 4 of us hit, Gili is a 1k inactive git - so that left Andy who i had stated was active and deserved to be given the benefit of the doubt.
I though Odo had buggered off - so shows how much attnetion I was paying. Wags I knew woudlnt be on to discuss with - but he probably frankly didn't give a shit anyway and Joe90 whom I hadnt heard from for a long time, so I assumed he didnt give a shit either.

If I had confirmed with SOL we were hitting together I would have posted they were part of it - I would ahve let Exile know whom we had hit etc etc in the Angie GM/Members Forums - but go check nothing in either;
I had no idea whether the rest of MuM were hitting let alone another guild in a diff time zone.

Okay I can be accused of being a crap GM to MuMs members - but I think my previous record will let most of them let me off on this occasion.
If I had actually though about it and wasnt so pissed off I could have maybe thoguht, hmmm i wodner if SOL really are gonna hit - but no I didnt think about it, nothing was confirmed and I had seen my arse about MuMs inactivity. I didn't evne know when they were ready, didnt know they had turns, cash etc - as I have stated I read Exiles message, replied shortly after that we were hitting TDoD whatever (when I thought as a whole guild we were gonna hit and not just 3 of us).

SOL are not to blame at all, my fek up so carry on with the Ricardo is a wanker etc stuff.

There rests the case for the defence - that was the truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me god.

Funny really there I was thinking it was a last huzza for me and MuM and yet again controversy follows us and I have had a number of non-MuM members stating they were gonna come to MuM next age and are we really disbanding - just know accounting for taste is there.

I am sure Lance wishes we stay so he can get revenge for this; I know how Dysh felt now in being loved so :D
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Postby Torkano » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:11 pm

Ash wrote:
Torkano wrote:DK, I said already that Ric shouldn't have been specific when he was talking about who was warring. SOL said they were invited. If Ric didn't tell them not to hit them I can only assume as well as SOL that Ric wanted them to hit. So there should be no blame on SOL for anything. If it was a planned combine attack, there is no interfering. Like I said with the one guild referrence, just because they all don't hit at the same chat time doesn't mean the rest of the guild is interfering in an already started war. I find it amusing that you call this interferrence. Holding out allies has been a common thing of the past, and I find it amusing that you call this interfering when a guild you are affiliated with has done it in the past along with many others including TNE. Its not uncommon. If the player base was much larger, I would have said this is crappy for the fact that they should've said allies will enter later but they won't say who it is. Unfortunately, if MuM mentioned allies it would be easy to assume its SOL since the numbers are pretty well matched up.


Well, a simple "MuM is now at war with TDoD" would've done. Leaves both ends open.


That's what I said in my first post. Ric shouldn't have hinted or made people think it was just MuM hitting. He definately shouldn't have said that he had allies, but he shouldn't have insinuated that it was just MuM. It would have saved a lot of grief and animosity. However, its done and people do make mistakes.
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Postby Torkano » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:21 pm

Good enough for me, Ric.
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Postby Bootsy Collins » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:33 pm

If you were a shite GM Ric, so were the rest of us.

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Postby Exile » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:44 pm

Now that Ric has responded, I'll post again. And in reading his post one thing that I should have done but didn't was confirm that we were going to follow when I got his message. But I took his message as an acknowlegement that we were coming and from that point on I hastily messaged the guild to get together for a chat, because we were on high alert anyways and besides Stark everyone had full turns. Since I was at work I don't have a lot of time, and I failed to write back.

So now I put the ball in TDoD's court...what do you want going forward?
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Postby DKII » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:44 pm

Tork - I don't blame SOL. But that's essentially what has happened. And hiding back allies was never standard until MuM did it to Fervent and age or two ago, Fervent certainly never hit anyone and didn't tell them exactly who was hitting with them at the time, it's a crap tactic to try and get the defending guild to waste all their turns either retaling the smaller attacker (who always goes first) instead of the bigger one, or being forced to guess and retaling the wrong big attacker and ending up getting banged by everyone anyway. As if first strike weren't a big enough advantage already. The difference between a guild having members show up a few hours later, is that the defending guild at least knows its at war with those late members! Sheesh.
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Postby Ricardo » Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:58 pm

DKII go read my post and you will see I wasnt holding any secret ally back - it was as is stated above.

I think the other incident you are referring to also included FEL with us on first strike - and enough whiging was done back then stop picking over old scabs you pillock, we can all refer to things past done or not done by others, but some just deal with the here and now.
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Postby Zhord. » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:06 pm

dk2 i'm so glad you got that off your chest but no one cares about your opinion. It's also nothing to do with you or fervent which your not currently part of.

though keep condemning ppl with your glorious version of fervent history it makes me chuckle.

@Ric get a grip mate, after that wall of text i almost feel sorry for you ;) All you had to do was ask nicely and you know i'd have come back.
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Postby MAlahzar » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:07 pm

To be honest I'm not surprised by any of this at all.

MUM's lies
Sol's interference

Dishonourable gameplay just seems to be part of the angelique faith It should be expected.I was shocked honesly and pleasantly surprised when I saw the hit by MUM in this thread to begin with it was honourable and very ballsy something I have never seen from an angelique guild in the 7 ages I've played (AOA excluded) I thought maybe finally something had struck with atleast one of their guilds in the entirety of Canon and that Maybe just maybe things might be changing for the faith atleast here in guilds anyway but no of course that can't be the case instead it turns out they were being manipulative and duplicitous in their actions and statements Oh well I'm tired of this nonsense.

People always talk about how we need a larger player base for canon but they will do nothing to help keep the players we do bring in.

One of the things that will surely drive players from this game is the growing lack of honour or sense of fair play however you choose to put it that the current player base is showing...
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Postby Ricardo » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:10 pm

Malahzar your part of barnabas - go on tell me anything honourable about that faith - fuck all you hypocritical twat.
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Postby MAlahzar » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:20 pm

Malahzar your part of barnabas - go on tell me anything honourable about that faith - fuck all you hypocritical twat.

TDOD Boy that was a easy one any more brain busters????????

Also as a gm my honour and that of the members of the guild have never been questioned.So don't call me a hypocrite for speaking of honour please.

Now Ricardo if you have anything of even remote intelligence to post in regards to my above post or this one for that matter please do so but don't go throwing insults.

Oh and fuck you right back Ricardo.
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Postby Dyvim Tvar » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:26 pm

to taking the last Mr Kiplings Cherry Bakewell.

There's always one son of a bitch who does that. I bet you don't respect the sanctity of the last jaffa cake either, do you? Bastard!!
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